SCOTT DETROW, HOST:
De facto Democratic nominee Kamala Harris has to choose a running mate by August 7. And the list of possible VPs is long, and speculation about that final choice is rampant. We are going to spend the next few minutes talking specifically about a few of the top contenders, as well as what Harris seems to generally be looking for as she looks for a running mate. And to do that, I am joined by Bloomberg congressional reporter Jonathan Tamari. Hey, Jonathan.
JONATHAN TAMARI: Hey, Scott. Thanks for having me.
DETROW: Arizona Republic reporter Ronald Hansen. Hey, Ronald.
RONALD HANSEN: Hi, Scott. Thanks for having me.
DETROW: And WUNC political reporter Colin Campbell, Colin, thanks for joining us.
COLIN CAMPBELL, BYLINE: Hey, Scott.
DETROW: So Jonathan, I feel like I should point out that this roundtable of reporters seems to look an awful lot like the list of candidates that Kamala Harris is considering. That's because there seem to be a few specific political goals, immediately political goals that the Harris campaign is trying to accomplish. Generally, what does Harris seem to be looking for in a running mate?
TAMARI: So she's looking for balance, and that means a lot of different things. First off is probably ideological balance. She is from one of the most liberal states in the country, and so I think she's going to be looking for somebody who's maybe - based on the list we have so far, people who have appealed in swing states and can appeal to moderate voters, have a history of doing that. Probably looking for some balance in terms of identity - you know, her list is very heavy on - you know, she's going to be a groundbreaking president - on having someone who's a white man, who's more conventional in our history, as her vice president. And then she's looking based on the list you have here, people who have won in battlegrounds or in and around battlegrounds, people who have won, even in some conservative states.
DETROW: And let's start talking specifically. Ronald, I'm going to start with you in Arizona and former combat pilot, former astronaut, current Senator Mark Kelly, who definitely has the most intriguing biography of all the people on this list. What do we need to know about Mark Kelly?
HANSEN: Yeah, I think it begins with that biography. One other line to add, perhaps, is his wife is former Congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords. She was a survivor of an attempted assassination herself in 2011. So Mark Kelly has been in the national eye for a number of years in a number of different contexts. He was an astronaut. He was the spouse standing by his wife when she was grievously wounded. He was a spokesman for gun control efforts in the wake of all that. Then he became a U.S. senator. He took the seat that had belonged to John McCain until his death in 2018. And because he was completing that term for Senator McCain, he had to not just win in 2020, but he had to run for reelection again in 2022. So he's been twice vetted by voters in a swing state, and that seems to have some appeal or at least suggest some possibility that he has appeal in a place that it's not an easy run for a Democrat.
DETROW: You look at all the polls for the past year, and there's a lot of voter concern about immigration. That's a political weak spot for the Biden/Harris administration. Vice President Harris has played a high-profile role in that issue. So there's been a lot of attention on how Kelly thinks and talks about immigration. What do we need to know about his immigration policies?
HANSEN: Two things probably stand out. No. 1, he has called the Southern border a crisis. That's his word. That is not the most supportive language, to put it mildly, of a Democratic administration, but it was, I think, an acknowledgment of the reality on the ground. It was also a political imperative for his own reelection in 2022. He has been critical of the administration as it relates specifically to the border.
DETROW: Let's talk about North Carolina Governor Roy Cooper for a little bit. Colin, if you want to save a listener a Google, what should somebody know about Roy Cooper, about his background, about his time as governor?
CAMPBELL: So Cooper is wrapping up his second term as governor. He's term limited so wouldn't be running again this year. Prior to that, he spent 16 years as the state's attorney general. That's where he got to know Kamala Harris. When she was attorney general out in California, they worked together on some initiatives. Prior to that, he was in the legislature for a number of years - actually, has been in elected office since 1986. He's a small-town attorney from eastern North Carolina, very much a creature of politics here in North Carolina, Democratic Party but has been very successful at the state level in ways that Democrats have not on the presidential ticket. In 2020, he won his race by 4 1/2%. Biden lost the state by about one percentage point. So as Democrats are looking to see if they can't fix that in 2024 and win the state for the first time since 2008, they're looking at Cooper's record of electoral success and wondering, I think, whether putting him on the ticket might get them a extra couple of percentage points here in North Carolina.
DETROW: So Jonathan, let's go to Pennsylvania now, a state that you and I have both spent a lot of time covering. Josh Shapiro has been in politics for a long time. He's held a lot of different roles, including attorney general, including governor. What, to you, is the most important or most interesting aspect of his background and his biography, what he would bring in this moment?
TAMARI: Probably the most important from an electoral perspective is that he's the most successful politician in recent memory in the biggest swing state on the map. Pennsylvania has got more electoral votes than any other battleground, and Shapiro is undefeated. And he's somebody who has an ability to speak to many different aspects of Pennsylvania, which also reflect a lot of the different aspects of a lot of battlegrounds. And so that's the most important political aspect he brings.
DETROW: All right. Let's end this by covering our bases. Let's do kind of a lightning round, and I want to ask each of you which people you're thinking about that you've seen on the list that you think could be unconventional and intriguing, other than the people we focused on here. Jonathan?
TAMARI: Governor Andy Beshear of Kentucky is intriguing just because he's won such a deep-red state. But I'd be interested to see if he takes some of what's worked in Kentucky and apply that in some of the other battlegrounds. The fact that there's a Democratic governor there is remarkable, and so I think he could be a fascinating person if he ends up on the ticket.
DETROW: All right, Ronald, who's your dark horse veep?
HANSEN: Governor Gretchen Whitmer in Michigan - I think, given the challenge of whether Americans will elect a woman as president, it's sort of a deal-breaker that they would elect two women on the ticket. She has exactly the kind of profile that one would like to see in a ticket.
DETROW: Colin, you want to go big with a dark horse?
CAMPBELL: Yeah, I'd be interested to see if there's any really consideration given to the governor of Maryland. That would be a situation where you'd have two Black candidates on the ticket, so I don't know if Democrats feel like they're willing to take that risk.
DETROW: I'm going to have a big dark horse I haven't seen in any lists anywhere in that I always thought that if Harris somehow needed a VP, former New Orleans Mayor Mitch Landrieu would be an interesting choice - charismatic guy, knows everyone in Democratic politics and spent the last few years kind of pushing for the stimulus spending. So we'll see which one of us is right or wrong, but thanks to all of you for helping fill in the background on some of these key contenders as Harris looks to find a vice president. That was WUNC political reporter Colin Campbell, Arizona Republic reporter Ronald Hansen and Bloomberg congressional reporter Jonathan Tamari. Thanks to all of you.
CAMPBELL: Thanks, Scott.
HANSEN: Thank you.
TAMARI: Thank you. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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